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HeliTorque Forum Index » Wannabes

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Logan
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 20, 2008 2:43 pm    Post subject: training times Reply with quote

ill post this here as so i can stop bothering the students, i am a student, technically not till the new year but ill leave that aside.

Here is my question: is training in the winter more difficult than training in the summer? My CPL(H) starts on Jan 17th and will run till April. So a majority of my training will be subject to cold weather. I guess what are some of the Pro's and Con's of when ill be training?



Logan
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PilotWolf
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 20, 2008 2:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Apart from the good old British weather? Smile

Cons:
More flights cancelled because of the poor conditions.
Less daylight hours for flying.
Worse case is the R22 isn't cleared for flight in icing conditions.
Getting wet and cold doing preflight.

Pros:
Better aircraft/instructor availablity?
Maybe negociate reduced rates if school quiet?!
You ll be licenced ready to enjoy the summer flying yourself around!
Christmas list to include EB6 computer, headset, books, etc. Smile

W.
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 20, 2008 3:41 pm    Post subject: Winter flyign Reply with quote

Logan,

Pilot Wolfe summed it up nicely. The main problem I found in winter with most pilots is the tendency to rush the pre-flight because of the cold. It didn't matter whether it was for fixed wing or helicopter. Copter pilots do spend a bit more time going over the aircraft, so it doesn't sit well when we have to climb around the rotor mast in cold windy weather.

Pilots who rush a preflight are begging for disaster. Take your time, even if you have to go back inside for awhile to warm up, then continue where you left off. NEVER EVER RUSH A PREFLIGHT!

I have seen many crazy scenes when pilots rush: rotor tiedowns not removed, fuel caps left off by the line, ground handling wheels left unlocked (but retracted), and on a 300, a main belt was missing! Pilots overlooked all of the above because it was cold, blistery wind or both.

Never rush to the scene of your accident! Fly safe!
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 20, 2008 4:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've also asked my instructor this, as I'll be doing most of my training over winter. He reckons November is the worst because the wind really picks up, but then it calms down again by December. The engine also generates more power in cold temperatures. Think I'll be investing in a very thick woolly hat though...
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Logan
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 20, 2008 4:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

yeah, i agree with the whole not rushing of the preflight! I tend to be ok with cold weather though, average Calgary winter tends to sit around -10 to -15. But no i completely agree with not rushing the check. is there a higher rick of carb icing under colder weather?
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 20, 2008 4:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sorry missed you were in Calgary!

Carb icing is most likely to occur when there is a high moisture content in the air and the temperature is below about 70F.

But its more common at low power (= low Manifold Pressure) I think the R22 Carb Air Temp gauge says to apply the carb heat below 18in MP.

One of the risks with the Robinsons is that the governor tries to compensate for the reduced RPM so the pilot is less likely to notice.

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Logan
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 20, 2008 8:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ill be sure to keep that valuable piece of info in mind Wolf thanks! At first i was a touch worried about training in the winter but now it seems like it will be fine, its usually quite dry here and tends to be cold! none the less ill be sure to keep the carb heat and governor in mind! thanks everyone!

Any other pro's/con's from you pros would be great!

Logan
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 20, 2008 8:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This is a carb icing graph that the CAA distribute to show the 'idle' weather conditions:



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PostPosted: Mon Oct 20, 2008 9:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

not sure if its the computer im on or your post is missing the link wolf but i cant see the graph your talking about!
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 20, 2008 9:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have to apply carb heat a lot while flying (OAT is around 16 degrees C) and always when using less than 18 inches MAP, as PW says. Don't worry - your instructor will be sure to point it out. Continuously. Laughing Apparently when I fly solo I'll pretty much have to use it all the time as I won't need much power to fly. Not that I'm that light... Big Grin
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 20, 2008 9:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

yeah i doubt they'd leave me hanging (instructors). how well does the heater work when its like -10C? im just hoping that its not terribly cold while im in there! ill be sure to get some warm thin gloves for sure! probly some dark sunglasses, keep that bright snow from shinning to brightly! Oh and another thing, after i solo, my school has the hazing ritual of dumping a bucket of water on the student once their back! So ill have to look forward to when its nice and cold out!
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 21, 2008 12:50 am    Post subject: training Reply with quote

JEN

Even the POH on the Schweizer recommends carb heat when pulling less than 18"MP in the CB, and anytime the CAT gauge starts into the yellow range.

You will loose some power when it is applied which is a sign that it is working as it should.

Always include the OAT gauge in your scan.

Fly safe
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 21, 2008 1:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Can everyone else see the picture? Its showing on mine...

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 21, 2008 1:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I started my fixed-wing training in October / November a few years ago. I had far more lessons cancelled due to weather from about March / April onwards than I did during December / January / February. In my experience, the British winter is a better time for flying that the spring. Bear in mind that nice cold clear days have better vis than hazy days in the summer, and you tend to get better performance (both engine and aerofoil) when the air is cold. Oh, and at least when it's too cold you can put on more clothes to compensate - flying a heli in the heat of summer is far more uncomfortable.

Only problem I had with heli lessons last winter was my tendency to mist up my side of the bubble due to heavy breathing / excess sweating!


Last edited by spl23 on Tue Oct 21, 2008 2:16 pm; edited 1 time in total
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 21, 2008 1:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If your heli lives in a hangar, I suppose you could preflight before you wheel the heli out into the cold Confused

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