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HeliTorque :: View topic - Autoratation-an important training for all helicopter pilots
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HeliTorque Forum Index » Flight Dynamics

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Autoratation-an important training for all helicopter pilots Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3  Next
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Logan
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 05, 2009 7:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

after 90 hours in the 22, and i get into the 44 and 206 i get to do engine off autos. Now i definitely have something to look forward too Shocked Shocked Shocked ill make sure to bring my depends!
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 05, 2009 7:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

your 'depends' ??? Spare change of pants wouldn't go a miss for the first time after that it's a challenge and is good fun
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 05, 2009 8:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

animalsticks wrote:
......wasn't nearly as much fun doing engine offs in the B206.


Yup, the trouble is, the 206 doesn't know the engine IS out! Laughing Laughing It's amazing at how much inertia the rotor system has in the 206.

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 05, 2009 8:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Allegedly you can auto a 206 to the ground and then pick it up again and reposition on your chosen landing spot...

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 05, 2009 8:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

haha AS, from how the 206 is made out to sound im definitely going to get some hours and the endorsement on it! Let alone the fact it has a turbine Very Happy
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 05, 2009 8:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

PilotWolf wrote:
Allegedly you can auto a 206 to the ground and then pick it up again and reposition on your chosen landing spot...

W.


Well, I know you can pick it up and move it a few feet, but I don't know about moving it to another landing spot. I would be happy to get it down period. Laughing

I rode with a combat pilot who got the Bell 47 up once after the initial set-down for a few feet, and almost had enough enertia left to lighten the skids on the 3rd try, but it wouldn't come up.

Advantage of the R22.....Once it's on the ground, it's not going anywhere.
Laughing Laughing
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 05, 2009 8:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

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Well, I know you can pick it up and move it a few feet, but I don't know about moving it to another landing spot. I would be happy to get it down period.


Think it's more a case of changing the heading than moving to another spot.

Quote:
Advantage of the R22.....Once it's on the ground, it's not going anywhere.


Presumably on a truck bed if you've just auto'd it!

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 05, 2009 8:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I loved EOL's in the R22, always exciting! The R44 was easier in a training environment, ie. 2 persons on board, very light and loads of time, 4 on board, well it was not as easy, heavier, higher RoD, less collective to cushion touch down etc.

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 05, 2009 9:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

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Think it's more a case of changing the heading than moving to another spot....

Yes, I agree, but I've seen both done.

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Presumably on a truck bed if you've just auto'd it!

That's what I've heard! As long as the pilot is able to get into the truck!

Very Happy
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 05, 2009 10:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

i once read an article interviewing simon 'Doctor' fox, a radio one chart Dj, who owns and flys/flies (?) helis.
he had a bell 47 and when doing training on it he was demonstrated an EOL with a pick up and 360 degree turn, apparently with little sink! thats some inertia. Surprised

One down side to high inertia rotor systems is if you are unfortunate enough to loose a lot of rotor rpm - you're probably not going to get it back - an upside on the R22 but you MUST keep it in check - Idea

or you'll shear the Jesus bolt and it's called that as HE's the only one who can help you Laughing
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 05, 2009 10:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

animalsticks wrote:
i One down side to high inertia rotor systems is if you are unfortunate enough to loose a lot of rotor rpm - you're probably not going to get it back - an upside on the R22 but you MUST keep it in check - Idea


Yes indeed. Having a high inertia rotor system is good because the decay is gradual, but by the same token, it takes more time to spool up again.

The R-22 in spite of all the bad "press" with a low enertia system, can regain inertia rapidly.

Take the good with the bad.

Laughing
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 05, 2009 10:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Does anybody know if there's an autopilot that can establish an autorotation???
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 06, 2009 11:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Not that I know of but, some autopilot sytems (4 axis) like the S92 will reduce collective setting in the event of single engine failure. With dual engine failure I am not sure if the collective will continue to lower. At the sim in Farnborough later this month, will have a play and see what happens. Will do some investigation myself into the books...

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 06, 2009 12:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Also could you see if once in auto if you initiate the ap will it recover to continue to set track or need assistance? especially near the ground or at low heights.
Look forward to hearing what happens Cool
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 06, 2009 12:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bingo, I knew that I knew it...

On the S92 the AP decouples in the event of dual engine failure, will double check though.

As for coupling up the AP after dual engine failure... I wouldn't want to, you don't have much time from say 2000' and it would simply distract you from making a good landing site. I am not sure if it would let you anyway.

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