Welcome Guest
HeliTorque
  
User Control Panel

Security Code: : Security Code
Type Security Code Here: :
 
Register Here
Lost Password?

Online Stats:
Visitors: 52
Members: 0
Total: 52

Membership:
New Today: 0
New Yesterday: 0
Registering: 0
Members: 6662
Latest: chrisw

Most Ever Online
Visitors: 447
Members: 10
Total: 457


HeliTorque :: View topic - Learning to fly in a 300 or R22
Forum FAQ
Forum FAQ
Search
Search
Memberlist
Memberlist
Usergroups
Usergroups
Profile
Profile
Contact Manager
Contact Manager
Log in
Log in
Log in to check your private messages
Log in to check your private messages
HeliTorque Forum Index » Student Pilots & Hour Builders

Post new topic   Reply to topic All times are GMT
Learning to fly in a 300 or R22
View previous topic :: View next topic  

300 or R22
300
50%
 50%  [ 8 ]
R22
50%
 50%  [ 8 ]
Voted : 16
Total Votes : 16
This poll does not expire

Author Message
lexboi
Starting to 'Torque
Starting to 'Torque


Offline
Joined: Apr 29, 2009
Posts: 18



PostPosted: Mon Jun 27, 2011 10:18 am    Post subject: Learning to fly in a 300 or R22 Reply with quote

Whats better to learn in an R22 or a 300 - I want to learn to fly (CPL) but I don't know what helicopter to do it in.

I have heard people say the R22 is a bit more responsive than a 300, were as the 300 is a bit more forgiving.

what are your opinions????
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
flip2
High Flying 'Torquer
High Flying 'Torquer


Offline
Joined: Sep 05, 2009
Posts: 225



PostPosted: Mon Jun 27, 2011 10:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Best to learn on in terms of physically flying, or best to learn on in terms of future work opportunities?

I think the two are intrinsically linked.

If you want to make a living from flying what is your likely first job in NZ? (presuming you wish to remain there). What aircraft types do they usually operate? If you will be flying 300's and 500's then the 300 makes sense. If you will be flying 22's and 44's then the 22 makes sense. If you're going to be flying something else entirely then this logic weakens.

Also, don't overlook the importance of the training school when it comes to primary training. I'd rather take the most suitable school over a preference for either the H269 or R22.

(an internet search will throw up a lot of opinions on this topic - IMO without a clear winner)
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
animalsticks
H Addict
H Addict


Offline
Joined: Jul 12, 2008
Posts: 741
Location: solihull


uk.gif

PostPosted: Mon Jun 27, 2011 10:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

R22 - Cheaper = more flying Smile

Unless you're Fat, sorry i mean big boned = 300

Fatter, slower, heavier, eats more, bit sluggish although it generally won't chew its own arse and can carry more - have you ever dated a fat chick?

I prefer the nippier "i'm going to kill you if you don't treat me right" type = cheaper Idea
_________________
PPL (H)
R22
B206
If it moves i want a go
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Yahoo Messenger MSN Messenger
mungo5
'Torquing Regularly
'Torquing Regularly


Offline
Joined: Jun 01, 2006
Posts: 98


usa.gif

PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2011 1:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Easy choice.

PPL in the 300, then CPL in the 22.

300 is a much more forgiving aircraft, and designed to be a trainer. Often you'll hear people say 22's are 'harder' to fly, and they're certainly twitchier on the controls. When you're at zero hours the last thing you want is a aircraft not designed to train students in, i.e. the 22. So save that pleasure for your CPL when you've got some good hours under your belt.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
lexboi
Starting to 'Torque
Starting to 'Torque


Offline
Joined: Apr 29, 2009
Posts: 18



PostPosted: Thu Jul 07, 2011 9:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The 300 is very common on ag work were as the R22 is mostly used on training. I would like to do more ag/commercial work so I might go for the 300 + i know of a 300 that i can learn in.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
PilotWolf
H Addict
H Addict


Offline
Joined: Sep 7, 2004
Posts: 1328
Location: Southern California.


blank.gif

PostPosted: Fri Jul 08, 2011 3:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

lexboi wrote:
The 300 is very common on ag work were as the R22 is mostly used on training. I would like to do more ag/commercial work so I might go for the 300 + i know of a 300 that i can learn in.


Hundreds but might narrow it down a bit if you said where you were!

W.
_________________
In memory of Skippy the Dog - "www.pilotsnpaws.org"  - RIP Scruffy.x
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website Yahoo Messenger MSN Messenger
STS
Shy 'Torquer
Shy 'Torquer


Offline
Joined: Jul 04, 2011
Posts: 3



PostPosted: Fri Jul 08, 2011 5:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

mungo5 wrote:
Easy choice.

PPL in the 300, then CPL in the 22.

300 is a much more forgiving aircraft, and designed to be a trainer. Often you'll hear people say 22's are 'harder' to fly, and they're certainly twitchier on the controls. When you're at zero hours the last thing you want is a aircraft not designed to train students in, i.e. the 22. So save that pleasure for your CPL when you've got some good hours under your belt.


That honestly sounds like a good idea - I personally did not learn on a 300, it was 22 from the start and also I have only flown it for about half an hour after I got about 350 hours in R22 and a few in the R44.

As far as I can tell it was no problem whatsoever to transition from the Robinson products to the 300 (throttle manipulation shouldnīt be a problem either as long as it was covered well during your training in the Robbies. It feels different, no kidding, but I agree with the general more forgiving, not so twichie handling of the 300.

For me best to describe was that it just hangs there - whereas the R22 kind of tries to play some tricks on you here and there.

what you canīt compare is tail rotor authority (I was simply spoiled from my time in the R22 / R44) but if you are aware of that shouldnīt be a problem either.

And of course other characteristics are very different as well (no better or worse, just different) autorotation, ... - but hey, itīs 2 different aircraft - I donīt think I need to tell you that they will have different characteristics, right.

Also I agree on what was mentioned as well on here already - look into what you would like to do after your training - for me it was instruction (did my training in the US) so the Robinson was my helicopter of choice for that.

Something I can not really judge is the fact that the 1 300 we had at the school was in MTX all the freaking time - so a lot of canceled flights for the students - Iīm not saying that Robies donīt go in MTX but if you compare that particular 300 and another R22 out of the fleet the time in MTX was a lot higher for the 300 - what I canīt say is if thatīs a general rule for all of the 300īs

Hope that could help a little bit,
Stefan
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
LoachBoy
H Addict
H Addict


Offline
Joined: Mar 03, 2010
Posts: 253
Location: Devon



PostPosted: Fri Jul 08, 2011 7:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

300s should be no worse than an R22...... as with any machine (car, bike, boat, whatever) you can get a dog, but if they've been maintained correctly and operated responsibly they should be fine.

I've only ever had issues with 1 300, but flown 4 others (3 of them quite alot) and not had a problem.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
flip2
High Flying 'Torquer
High Flying 'Torquer


Offline
Joined: Sep 05, 2009
Posts: 225



PostPosted: Fri Jul 08, 2011 11:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

STS wrote:
Something I can not really judge is the fact that the 1 300 we had at the school was in MTX all the freaking time - so a lot of canceled flights for the students - Iīm not saying that Robies donīt go in MTX but if you compare that particular 300 and another R22 out of the fleet the time in MTX was a lot higher for the 300 - what I canīt say is if thatīs a general rule for all of the 300īs

This was my experience too. I've flown 16 x R22's (beta and beta II) and 6 x 300's (A, B (I think!), C, CB but no CBi) and the 300's were definitely more maintenance intensive and had more unscheduled maintenance than Robinson counterparts.

However, provided that you are not learning in a single-aircraft school I wouldn't give this too much thought.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Hughes500
H Addict
H Addict


Offline
Joined: Jan 18, 2006
Posts: 334
Location: Devon


uk.gif

PostPosted: Fri Jul 08, 2011 6:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hm thought Bristows in Florida changed to 300'sfrom 22's due to 22's spending too long in maintenance.
I have 2 x 300's very rearely let me down, like anything depends how you look after it.
If you trim a 300 well you can take your hand off the cylic in the hover ( school record is 33 secs hands off)ty that in a robbie !!!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
flip2
High Flying 'Torquer
High Flying 'Torquer


Offline
Joined: Sep 05, 2009
Posts: 225



PostPosted: Fri Jul 08, 2011 6:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hughes500 wrote:
Hm thought Bristows in Florida changed to 300'sfrom 22's due to 22's spending too long in maintenance.

Quite possibly - I believe they operate CB's and CBi's... I have no experience in the latter but common sense would suggest that the design has come along somewhat since the 1950s!!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
ALFA8C
H Addict
H Addict


Offline
Joined: Jan 16, 2009
Posts: 328


blank.gif

PostPosted: Fri Jan 13, 2012 8:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Guys,

Sorry to bring up an old thread BUT what is the definitive answer to the OP question?

300 or R22 to complete the PPL(H)?

Also a couple of more questions please:

Which would you consider to be the most important:
Price?
Location?
Aircraft Choice ie R22 or 300?
Friendliness and professionalism of the FTO/Instructors?


Last edited by ALFA8C on Fri Jan 13, 2012 9:59 pm; edited 1 time in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Hughes500
H Addict
H Addict


Offline
Joined: Jan 18, 2006
Posts: 334
Location: Devon


uk.gif

PostPosted: Fri Jan 13, 2012 9:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

A8C

The most important thing is the instructor. He/she will get to know you very very well, if " it " doesnt happen between you , you are wasting your money. Make sure that your instructor has some real world experience otherwise you are wasting your money.
as to the different machines, one was built to a price one was built to a military specification, need say no more.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
flip2
High Flying 'Torquer
High Flying 'Torquer


Offline
Joined: Sep 05, 2009
Posts: 225



PostPosted: Sat Jan 14, 2012 5:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hughes500 wrote:
as to the different machines, one was built to a price one was built to a military specification, need say no more.

What is that old military adage? Something like "Always keep in mind that your weapon was made by the lowest bidder"

Wink
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Hughes500
H Addict
H Addict


Offline
Joined: Jan 18, 2006
Posts: 334
Location: Devon


uk.gif

PostPosted: Sun Jan 15, 2012 7:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Flip
I know what you mean, so you are obviously saying that the R22 was built for the military !!!!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    HeliTorque Forum Index » Student Pilots & Hour Builders All times are GMT

 
Page 1 of 1

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


Sponsors


Billund Air Center

Visit HeliTorque!