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HeliTorque Forum Index » Ground School

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Logan
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 22, 2008 9:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

very true! So in Canada you dont need the twin turbine! heck you dont even need a turbine! a school not to far from calgary offers the IR on either the 22 or the 44! yet the IR costs $9000 for the 22 and almost $11000 for the 44!!!!
so i see what you mean about the instructor
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WindSwept
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 22, 2008 9:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Logan wrote:
very true! So in Canada you dont need the twin turbine! heck you dont even need a turbine! a school not to far from calgary offers the IR on either the 22 or the 44! yet the IR costs $9000 for the 22 and almost $11000 for the 44!!!!
so i see what you mean about the instructor
]

Yea and change that dollar sign for a pound sign for the cheapest UK prices Shocked
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Logan
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 22, 2008 9:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

NO WAY! I officially think all you should come down to Canada and train here then! Why is it so much more expensive for training in the UK compared to Canada and the states?
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WindSwept
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 22, 2008 9:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Logan wrote:
NO WAY! I officially think all you should come down to Canada and train here then! Why is it so much more expensive for training in the UK compared to Canada and the states?


Not sure, i guess fuel comes into it somewhat but other than that not sure, i don't know enough about the industry for that!

PPL(H) has gotta be 10-12k over here????
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Jen
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 22, 2008 9:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

More like 18,000-20,000. That's what I'm budgeting for my PPL Rolling Eyes
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WindSwept
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 22, 2008 9:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jen wrote:
More like 18,000-20,000. That's what I'm budgeting for my PPL Rolling Eyes


Yea i guess it depends on the hours, how good you are, whats per hour cost at your school?

Minimum is 45 hours but they definatly plucked that out of the air, i reckon its more like 50-60 hours
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Jen
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 22, 2008 10:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

They have pricing structure I suspect Einstein would have trouble getting his head around. It varies a lot depending on what day of the week it is, how much I paid in advance into my account and whether Taurus is in the ascendant - but around 300 an hour for the R22.
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WindSwept
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 22, 2008 10:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jen wrote:
They have pricing structure I suspect Einstein would have trouble getting his head around. It varies a lot depending on what day of the week it is, how much I paid in advance into my account and whether Taurus is in the ascendant - but around 300 an hour for the R22.


Yea, i know what you mean, if you prepay or block book, price goes down per hour, but then prices for landing fees, circuits, all sorts etc etc which arn't factored into your cost.

Get this, even working for the airport doesn't get you free landing fees!!! how sheite is that! especially when you work in the tower and could just ask the controllers to not record your landings for you.
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Logan
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 22, 2008 10:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

yeah, here the PPL(H) would probly average around $25000, the CPL(H) costs anywhere from 47k to a max of about 60k, based directly on the helis flown and extra hours!
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flingingwings
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 14, 2008 8:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Windswept,

IMHO the FI or IR debate is not quite so clear cut. It is all a matter of timing.

Post CPL you can go either route, and the overall costs will be the same.
True there are more flying schools than IFR operators, but there is very little progression with FI'ing, the earning potential is significantly less and in the current economic climate I'm not convinced an FI rating is a sure fire guaranteed employment opportunity.

The IR is higher risk for far higher gain.

Best option is to evaluate the industry when 'you' have to make the decision then
.
Many FI's end up paying for an IR anyhow, just a few years later and having re done the theory exams. With an IR you are restricted in the UK to basically the 'Big 3' offshore operators, the bigger risk is what to do if they for whatever reason either aren't hiring or don't wish to hire you.

If you fancy the FI route then useful ratings are R22/H369 and R44 as most people learn on these. A turbine rating is of limited value as newly qualified you more than likely won't be teaching on it.

A 206 rating is worth considering if you're contemplating the IR route because it gets you used to the differences of turbine flying, and if you complete your IR in an As355 its basically like starting a jet ranger engine only twice.

I did the FI first then the IR 16 months later. Wish with hindsight I'd done the IR from the outset. BUT that was then, and now either option is a very big gamble.

Worry about it when you have to and speak to IFR operators as well as potential FI course providers Very Happy

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WindSwept
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 14, 2008 8:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yea im not saying that FI is better than IR. But i think more of it comes down to money and job guarantes.

If your a CPL student you've just paid for an entire PPL, 155hours and now your on a commercial course spending more money then if you complete an FI course im pretty sure if your willing to travel you will find a job as an FI, if not even with the same school. By this point i reckon most people who arn't rich and who are paying for this off working a normal job are looking to earn some money to pay off the loans.

If i got my CPL and then someone said do your IR and we will guarantee you a job then i would do the IR definatly. But i think thats far less likely when they can hire FI's who have far more hours who can now afford to add some more ratings and tickets.
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WhirlyGirl
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 15, 2008 10:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think there will always be arguments both ways as to the FI vs IR debate, however, post CPL(H), for an extra 12k or so, an instructor rating opens so many doors, and is really a very rewarding career.

I always wanted to go the instructor route, so maybe I'm a bit biased but I certainly don't have any regrets - when I'm not instructing on the R22, I'm doing charter in the JetRanger, or doing type conversions onto the R44, so I really find it a great mix with a lot of variety (and with some very good students who pay attention it's also very satisfying!!).

And I know the pay is not as good as what the offshore guys get, but when you can pretty well earn back the cost of the FI course in one summer, and you enjoy it as much as I do it seems like a bit of a no-brainer. Don't know if I'll ever do my IR but have no intention of doing so at the moment. I think I'll stick to looking out of the window!!

Sarah
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CPL(H) / FI(H) - Cabri G2, R22, S300, R44, B206
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Logan
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 18, 2008 10:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

the offshore route sounds liek a good time! i wouldnt ming getting into that! is it mostly high hour pilots who get put on rigs or can low time (300-500) hours work too?
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BladeRunner
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 13, 2009 10:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I know of several people taken on the north sea with low hours. They either had connections, or struck at the right time in a buoyant market. Without any feet in any doors, an IR with more hours (including twin time) and tenacity would help.
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paddywak
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 04, 2009 9:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I bet those Rockys look great from up there? Definately do the mountain training. Good luck with the rest of your CPL.
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