Welcome Guest
HeliTorque
  
User Control Panel

Security Code: : Security Code
Type Security Code Here: :
 
Register Here
Lost Password?

Online Stats:
Visitors: 84
Members: 0
Total: 84

Membership:
New Today: 0
New Yesterday: 0
Registering: 0
Members: 6662
Latest: chrisw

Most Ever Online
Visitors: 546
Members: 0
Total: 546


HeliTorque :: View topic - Helicopter Lifespan, help me understand what I am looking at
Forum FAQ
Forum FAQ
Search
Search
Memberlist
Memberlist
Usergroups
Usergroups
Profile
Profile
Contact Manager
Contact Manager
Log in
Log in
Log in to check your private messages
Log in to check your private messages
HeliTorque Forum Index » Torque, Chat, and Chill!

Post new topic   Reply to topic All times are GMT
Helicopter Lifespan, help me understand what I am looking at
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
bom
High Flying 'Torquer
High Flying 'Torquer


Offline
Joined: Feb 22, 2010
Posts: 190
Location: Swansea



PostPosted: Tue Apr 20, 2010 8:17 pm    Post subject: Helicopter Lifespan, help me understand what I am looking at Reply with quote

Hey Guys,

Here is an Enstrom F28c for sale for 40k. It has a CoA for 1 year, 550 hours on the engine since overhaul and just under 2000 hours on the airframe.

http://www.ldhelicopters.co.uk/item.php?i=80

So, surely this is a bargain for anyone wanting to hour build. Simply buy it, fly the arse off it for a year and then sell it on.

So, what am I missing here? Surely bargain of the century.

They also have two other enstroms for less than 30k. I dont want to ask the seller any questions as this is simply a dream for at least the next 3 years.

Cheers,
Bom
_________________
Training for PPL(H), now at 15 hrs - R22
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
chopperjockey
High Flying 'Torquer
High Flying 'Torquer


Offline
Joined: Aug 15, 2007
Posts: 114
Location: Devon


uk.gif

PostPosted: Tue Apr 20, 2010 10:51 pm    Post subject: Re: Helicopter Lifespan, help me understand what I am lookin Reply with quote

bom wrote:


So, surely this is a bargain for anyone wanting to hour build. Simply buy it, fly the arse off it for a year and then sell it on.

So, what am I missing here? Surely bargain of the century.

They also have two other enstroms for less than 30k.

Cheers,
Bom


Selling it on could be the problem. If you buy it you will want to keep it! Smile

Not a bargain, sounds a good rate but it is the older shape. One of the other ones listed (280C) sounds a better deal and a newer shape.
_________________
UK PPL(H) R22 S269 EN28 MD369
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
bom
High Flying 'Torquer
High Flying 'Torquer


Offline
Joined: Feb 22, 2010
Posts: 190
Location: Swansea



PostPosted: Wed Apr 21, 2010 8:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hmmm, only a few years left on my mortgage...... Smile

CJ, you fly one of these dont you? Hired or owned? Any insight on running costs etc?
_________________
Training for PPL(H), now at 15 hrs - R22
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
tegwin
High Flying 'Torquer
High Flying 'Torquer


Offline
Joined: Oct 18, 2008
Posts: 200
Location: Worcestershire


uk.gif

PostPosted: Wed Apr 21, 2010 9:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

What is the rebuild time limit on an enstrom?

the R-22 is limited to X number of years.... even if you still have 1000 hours remaining on the components... the fact the time has expired means its time for rebuild anyway...
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
flip2
High Flying 'Torquer
High Flying 'Torquer


Offline
Joined: Sep 05, 2009
Posts: 225



PostPosted: Wed Apr 21, 2010 9:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I believe that there are very few calendar-life parts... lamaflex bearings rings a bell? This is a double-edged sword - you may get a great ownership run without having to replace anything major, or the previous owner may have got that jammy run Shocked

My experience on Enstroms is limited to one flight accompanying a PPL owner - it struck me as quite agricultural (not necessarily a bad thing) but I must admit that one was a true hangar queen.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
bom
High Flying 'Torquer
High Flying 'Torquer


Offline
Joined: Feb 22, 2010
Posts: 190
Location: Swansea



PostPosted: Wed Apr 21, 2010 12:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hey Tegwin, I can understand the R22 to a much greater extent due to their simple countdown philosophy but the entroms are more of a mystery.

Hey Flip2, I've read they have only 12 life limited parts but thats all I know.

How ofter does a CofA have to be renewed?

I think I need a flight in an enstrom, my current lust is purely a visual thing Smile
_________________
Training for PPL(H), now at 15 hrs - R22
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
CaptainKev
High Flying 'Torquer
High Flying 'Torquer


Offline
Joined: Apr 12, 2005
Posts: 170
Location: EGTO


uk.gif

PostPosted: Wed Apr 21, 2010 6:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I looked at the Enstrom as an option...

I like the quirky look...I like the 3 seats...I like a lot about them..

But I decided the Rotorway was a better option for me....2 blades for easier storage, you can get a brand new machine for similar money, insurance is cheaper, maintenance is cheaper, fuel costs are cheaper yatta yatta.

And if all you want to do is buzz around and hour build....perfect !

Dennis Kenyon will tell you all you need to know about Enstroms though...he was the UK agent for many years..... DennisRKenyon at aol.com

[Edited by GS, to remove Dennis email address as a mailto link, he gets lots of spam as it is]



Kev
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
bom
High Flying 'Torquer
High Flying 'Torquer


Offline
Joined: Feb 22, 2010
Posts: 190
Location: Swansea



PostPosted: Wed Apr 21, 2010 8:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hey Kev,

That is a lovely looking machine you have there. I'm surprised the insurance is cheaper being an un-typed machine (if I've got the term right there).

How many hours have you put on it so far? What are the running costs like?
_________________
Training for PPL(H), now at 15 hrs - R22
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
tegwin
High Flying 'Torquer
High Flying 'Torquer


Offline
Joined: Oct 18, 2008
Posts: 200
Location: Worcestershire


uk.gif

PostPosted: Wed Apr 21, 2010 8:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

That is a gorgeous looking machine!!! WANT! Smile
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
chopperjockey
High Flying 'Torquer
High Flying 'Torquer


Offline
Joined: Aug 15, 2007
Posts: 114
Location: Devon


uk.gif

PostPosted: Wed Apr 21, 2010 8:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Maintenance on our 280C is about 2 to 3K a year. Insurance another 3K then add the fuel and oil per hours flown. Used to cost overall about 15 to 20K based on 100 hrs a year. If you train on an R22, you will soon get used to it. When you finish your course and get your licence you will probably want to stay with what you know. I trained on a 22 then when qualified moved up to a 300 before buying an Enstrom. Didn't like the Enstrom at first because it was different. But Tim Price soon showed me how good the Enstrom is.
With the Enstrom you get a proper cyclic, a cargo bay, three seats, fuel injection (no carb heat), a turbo charger and three wacking great heavy blades to make autorotation a non event. Love it. Smile
_________________
UK PPL(H) R22 S269 EN28 MD369
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
CaptainKev
High Flying 'Torquer
High Flying 'Torquer


Offline
Joined: Apr 12, 2005
Posts: 170
Location: EGTO


uk.gif

PostPosted: Fri Apr 23, 2010 11:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote





Hello again

I only, finally, did the LST last week, so I've got 7.5 hours dual and a mere 30 mins P1 after positioning KEVL back to my house...see above

As summer appears to finally be kicking in I plan to get plenty of hours under my belt !

Fully comprehensive insurance was 2500 (but some owners just go for 3rd party cover which is under 1000)

She runs on cheaper Mogas as well as Avgas, and the burn is approx 30 litres per hours.....the Mogas option means I can fuel it myself most of the time so don't have to fly to an airport and pay a landing fee just to keep her topped up...

It's fuel injected so no carb heat to worry about...and has 'proper' cyclics !!

Maintenance is 'about' 1500 per annum....

If anyone can make it, I'll be at the North Weald fly-in tomorrow lunchtime with G-KEVL

Kev

Regarding Enstroms...as I said, I like them, quirky looking, 3 seats, cargo hold, very good safety record etc.

Word is, down to those 3 heavy blades you can "make a cup of tea" during an auto.....whereas the Rotorway like the R22 with the 2 blades, has low inertia....so if it all goes quiet...that lever needs to go down quick !
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
bom
High Flying 'Torquer
High Flying 'Torquer


Offline
Joined: Feb 22, 2010
Posts: 190
Location: Swansea



PostPosted: Fri Apr 23, 2010 12:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

CJ - If you ever feel like flying across the waters for a day trip and fancy showing me how good the Enstrom is I will happily make myself available thumbleft How many hours on type do you have now?

Kev, thats both a lovely looking ship and a lovely looking home you have there Smile

Are either of you coming to the Miskin Manor Fly In on May 15th?

Running costs seem fair on both machines (From my little understanding), insurance much less than I was expecting as is maintenance.
_________________
Training for PPL(H), now at 15 hrs - R22
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
muffin
'Torquing Regularly
'Torquing Regularly


Offline
Joined: Jul 27, 2004
Posts: 86
Location: Derbyshire


uk.gif

PostPosted: Sat May 01, 2010 6:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nice pics Kev. That machine was built by a neighbour of mine who used to live about 300 yards away from me. I looked at Rotorways and Enstroms before I bought my R22. I loved the Enstrom but the main negative was the 3 bladed rotor which meant it won't go into a shed if the door is narrow. I did an hour in a 162Exec and liked it, but in the end the low resale value and the maintenance requirements put me off. Having said that, my R22 times out this year so I am having to fork out another huge sum to buy a rebuilt one.

Trouble is, you don't actually buy an R22 - you just rent it from Frank for a few years. Very clever marketing.

Richard
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
CaptainKev
High Flying 'Torquer
High Flying 'Torquer


Offline
Joined: Apr 12, 2005
Posts: 170
Location: EGTO


uk.gif

PostPosted: Sat May 01, 2010 9:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Richard

I guess it's a 'swings and roundabouts' thing...each type having its pros and cons....

Small world eh...I never met JH but am in regular touch with him in Spain by email.....I'd say he and his brother did a pretty good build on my machine....I'm very happy with it !

Look out for Dennis Kenyon's article on me and G-KEVL coming soon in the Loop/Blades publication.

Kev
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    HeliTorque Forum Index » Torque, Chat, and Chill! All times are GMT

 
Page 1 of 1

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


Sponsors


Billund Air Center

Visit HeliTorque!